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 1115 - 1185 (~ 70 years)
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| Name |
Robert Avenel |
| Title |
Sir |
| Suffix |
Lord of Eskdale |
| Birth |
~ 1115 |
Normandy, France  [1] |
| Gender |
Male |
| Death |
8 Mar 1185 |
Langholm, Dumfries, Scotland [1] |
| Person ID |
I46755 |
The Hennessee Family |
| Last Modified |
19 Nov 2016 |
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| Notes |
- Name: Robert AVENEL Lord of Eskdale 1 2
Sex: M
Birth: ABT 1115 in Normandy
ALIA: Richard de AVENAL
Title: Sir
Death: 08 MAR 1185 in Langholm, Dumfries-shire, Scotland
Name: Robert AVENEL 3 4
Birth: ABT 1110 in of Sandhurst, Gloucestershire, England
Death: AFT 1180 in of Edinburgh, Midlothian, Scotland
Marriage 1 SIBYL b: ABT 1120 in Scotland
Children
Has Children Unknownl AVENEL b: ABT 1140 in Langholm, Dumfries-shire, Scotland
Has No Children Cleric Robert Avenel b: ABT 1152 in Langholm, Dumfries-shire, Scotland
Has Children Gervase AVENEL Lord of Eskdale b: ABT 1150 in Langholm, Dumfries-shire, Scotland
Has No Children John Avenel b: ABT 1155 in Langholm, Dumfries-shire, Scotland
Sources:
Author: Catherine Lucy Wilhilmina Stanhope Powlett
Title: The Battle Abbey Roll with Some Account of the Norman Lineages
Publication: Name: 1889 J. Murray;
Repository:
Name: Google Book
Page: 353-354
Text: n 1169, Robert Avenel witnessed another donation to this Priory, and the foundation charter of Welbeck Abbey.
Title: John P. Ravilious -soc.genealogy.medieval, at groups - google.com
Repository:
Name: soc.genealogy.medieval, at groups - google.com
Note:
Source Medium: Internet
Page: 6/11/2007
Text:
First, the relationship of the Avenels of Eskdale, and their Graham descendants, to the Avenel paramour of William 'the Lion', King of Scots (d. 1214) is reflected in the following chart.
This does not provide any other relationship to the royal house of Scotland (the Comyn ancestry of the Grahams aside), but it does show a near kinship with the de Ros family, of Helmsley, Wark, &c. Sir William de Ros of Helmsley (d. ca. 1264) and his brother, Sir Robert de Ros of Wark, were in fact 2nd cousins of the Avenel wife of Sir Henry de Graham of Dalkeith.
Robert Avenel = Sibyl [Sibilla] lord of Eskdale I d. 8 Mar 1184/5
I ________I___________
I I William ~ NN Gervase Avenel = Sibyl 'the Lion' I lord of Eskdale I K of I d. 1219 I Scots
I I _____I _________________________I_________
I I I I I Isabel Gervase Roger Robert William = 1) Sir Robert (dvp) lord of clerk de Brus (dsp) Eskdale = 2) Sir Robert d. 1243 I de Ros I __I______________ I I I I Sir William Sir Robert NN = Sir Henry de Graham de Ros of de Ros I of Dalkeith Helmsley of Wark I d. aft 5 Feb 1283/4 d. ca. 1264 d. 1269 I I I I V V V The other item alluded to above involves the Avenel family and their otherwise unidentified relations.
On 13 June 1213, King John of England ordered a number of hostages of the King of Scotland be released by their hosts, to be delivered to the King (of England) at Portsmouth.
One such letter is detailed in Bain's Calendar of Documents Pertaining to Scotland, addressed to Saier de Quincy, Earl of Winchester
[1]. As Bain wrote, there were " Similar letters written to Robert de Vaux concerning the son of William de Vaux; to William de Mobray concerning Nigel son of Philip de Mobray; to William son of Walkelin concerning the son of Gervase Avenel;.."
[2] There has been much ink spilt in the past concerning such transactions, and the relationships between the hostages and their appointed hosts. In the case of the 1213 transactions, I have seen no hostage-host relationship that did not also involve a known or discernable kinship, save one: that of the son of Gervase Avenel (likely his eldest son Gervase, who ob.v.p. before 1219) and William fitz Walkelin. William fitz Walkelin was most likely a near kinsman of the family of de Ferrers, earls of Derby. He held lands in Stainsby, Derbyshire, which he had obtained from Henry II in 1170, and is recorded as continuing in his tenure there in 1212
[3]. He died sometime before 4 April 1218, when Robert (le) Savage, husband of his deceased daughter Hawise, fined to have seisin of her lands in Lincolnshire [4]. One interesting possibility would place Sibyl, the mother of Gervase Avenel 'the elder', as a daughter of William de Ferrers, earl of Derby and his wife Sibyl de Braose. This may be something of a stretch, but the chronology would work. We know that this particular William de Ferrers (d. at Acre before 21 Oct 1190) had a kinsman, Henry son of Robert son of Wakelin, to whom he granted lands of his aunt Letitia de Ferrers in Passenham. Further, Earl William allegedly had a brother Walkelin, the father of Robert fitz Walkelin, ancestor of the Chaundos family (see SGM archives on this).
The possiblity that William fitz Walkelin was a brother of this Robert would make it chronologically feasible (although not nearly proven) that Gervase Avenel's son - possibly a great-nephew of Earl William (d. 1190) and his brother Walkelin - was being hosted by Earl William's nephew William fitz Walkelin, a first cousin to Gervase Avenel in June 1213. The identifiation of the parentage of William fitz Wakelin, and of his potential kinswoman (presumably Sibyl, mother or wife of Gervase Avenel) would be of great interest to the Graham and Douglas descendants of the Avenels, and also to the Savage descendants of William fitz Wakelin. Should anyone have additional thoughts or documentation that either support or refute the above conjecture, that would be of great interest.
Cheers, John *
NOTES [1] Bain, Calendar of Documents Pertaining to Scotland I:100-101, cites Foedera I:113; and Close Roll 15 John, p. 1, m. 4. : ' 574. Concerning the K. of Scotland's hostages. The K. to S[aher] earl of Winchester.
Title: Society of Genealogists, London-Woodward MSS
Title: Ancestral Roots by Weis-7th edition-GPC
Note:
Source Medium: Book [1]
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